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Oom Yung Doe students respond to accusations

My post last month about the martial arts school Oom Yung Doe generated quite a bit of feedback from our readers - in the comments section, at the Spectator forum on MySU, and in my e-mail inbox.

Many of the responses were from readers unhappy with our anonymous tipster's accusations. Surprisingly, many of these individuals are both SU students/alumni and participants in Oom Yung Doe's martial arts education.

Justin Martin, a 1995 SU graduate and nine year practitioner of Oom Yung Doe, highlights the positive results he has witnessed while training at the school:
The instructors I have known have always behaved ethically and have carried themselves with honor, integrity, and compassion. I have seen people from all walks of life, all professions, and all conditions, improve themselves in school.  

In terms of physical improvement, I can think of about eight peopledramatic positive changes. Most of them I know personally. I'll mention a few of them:

There was a student with Parkinson's Disease who walked on crutches when she came into school and had frequent seizures. After one to two years of training, she no longer needed the crutchesher seizures had almost completely stopped. I heard that she also successfully defended herself from a mugger as well.

There have been several students who have come in with severe rheumatoid arthritis. One of them couldn't stand, sit, or walk without severe pain. After a few years of training, she climbed Mt. Rainier twice.  

There have been students who have been told by western doctorshey have all either improved, reversed, or cured their conditions.
off the top of my head who experienced and that nothing could be done for their conditions; conditions such as broken backs, fibromyalgia, and destroyed knees. They have all either improved, reversed, or cured their conditions.
Yesterday, I received this e-mail from Thomas DeLeon, an SU senior who has been training with the school for more than a decade. On top of that, he helped build the school's new location on 12th Avenue with his own hands, and is now even teaching students in the art. His e-mail is long, but I don't feel it would be appropriate to cut from:
I felt that it is important I respond to this, as I am both a part of the School of Oom Yung Doe, and a senior at Seattle University. I have been training in this school for twelve years now. I can say without a doubt, that I have never experienced anything that is negative, in all the years of my training. Difficult, yes, sometimes the training can be incredibly challenging, but the challenges have only made me a better person. I have seen so many good things come from training, both for myself and for others, it is very disappointing to see something like this.
 
As you have seen, we recently moved the school to the new location on 12th ave. I personally have spent many hours working on the construction of the school, along with many other instructors and students who have put time and effort into it as well. You may remember the condition of that building prior to the school moving in. It had been boarded up for many years, and was run down and filled with trash. Over the course of several months, we have completely redone everything ourselves. People that walk by have commented on how it makes the block look so much better. It has been amazing to see what people can accomplish when they work together and set their minds to accomplish something. So it is personal to me to see something like this written about the school, after all of the efforts from myself and everyone else.
 
In the last few months, I have had the opportunity to begin teaching others. This has been very challenging for me, but has been extremely rewarding.  Throughout the years of my own training, I have benefited in countless ways, and have always looked up to the care and sincerity that every instructor in the school has. Now I see first hand just how much thought an instructor puts into everything that they do.
 
Speaking in front of others has always been very difficult for me. Being a college student, as you know it is something that you have to be able to do. Since I have started teaching, I am now confident when in front of others. As an example, I had to give a presentation last spring, and for the first time I was not nervous at all. I was absolutely amazed. I could finally do something that I was challenged with for a long time. And more importantly than my own benefits, I have started to see some of the students that I teach change for the better as well. Some of them have thanked me for teaching them, and it is an incredible feeling to know that I have been a part of them improving themselves, even if it is small.
 
The school as an organization has always been very involved in community events, throughout the nation. One of the unique things about Oom Yung Doe is that aside from the physical movements, there are also principles that are taught. One of these is of the importance of helping others and building community. So being involved with the community through events and charities has always been something important to all of us. There is a book in the school with photos of many of the events that we have participated in over the years, and anyone is welcome to look through this if they like.
 
When we first started working on this specific school, we specifically wanted to offer more things to the local community, especially to the university community of students. We currently have free lessons for students to come in and learn in some basic areas such as self-defense, meditation/stress relief, and strength and flexibility. Anyone is always welcome to come in and try a lesson, or ask any questions they might have.
 
I know that I have gained in so many ways from my own training, and no matter what anyone says, no one can ever take that away from me.  Instructors in the school are human, and do their best to follow the principles taught. However like any organization that is made up of people, people can make a mistake. Because an individual makes a mistake, you cannot say that the entire organization is bad. You need look no further than our own university, and the recent abuse settlement. If the university is truly bad because of that one individual, than none of us should be students here.
 
Having a positive effect on another person, no matter how small, is, to me, one of the greatest things one can achieve in life. It is worth more to me than any amount of money. I truly believe that the schools teach a way of improving myself and the community around me. I know that if I improve myself, I will have a better life. If I have a better life, it will improve those around me. If it improves the lives of those around me, it will help build a better community for all. So, to all I say come in and experience the training for yourself, not by what others say.
This brings a new twist to the Oom Yung Doe saga, and tells the story - through the eyes of participants, which wasn't the case with the newspaper investigations cited in my initial post - in a much different light. I'm interested to hear more from students at Oom Yung Doe, as the information presented by these readers shows their obvious respect for the school (and subsequent unhappiness over our publishing the anonymous tipster's claim).

Despite what folks like "gato" in The Spectator "news" forum might think, I'm not trying to sway opinions on this matter one way or another (and frankly, I haven't even figured out my own just yet). This isn't a "let's bash Oom Yung Doe" blog. I made it clear in my first post that the claims of our anonymous tipster (and the supporting evidence he provided) are just that - accusations - and that as the student newspaper of Seattle University, it is The Spectator's duty to at least look into them.

By offering their input and keeping their ear to the blogosphere, these commenters who support Oom Yung Doe have brought a new angle to this increasingly interesting story - and have provided balance to a piece that, until this point, had very little.
Published Wednesday, September 05, 2007 8:09 AM by lagattar
Filed Under: ,

Comments

 

justinjmartin said:

Rob,

Thank you very much for following up the original accusations with this posting.  I did want to point out that my name is wrong in the quotes above, and that some of the text from my original posting didn't seem to copy correctly, but that doesn't change the point that I and the students and instructors of Oom Yung Doe greatly appreciate this balance.  

Justin Martin
September 19, 2007 12:32 PM
 

Martial Artist said:

Much credibility still remains to the original post. Emotional reactions of current students aside, valid as those emotions may be - the only answers given to the tax fraud convictions fact so far have been: "I'm offended", "the schools do miraculous things that mere medicine cannot" and "all organizations have problems".

I hope the intellect of the average SU student demands a more solid rebuttal than this. Current members of Scientology will offer a strikingly similar response when criticism of that organization is voiced in any public forum.

Facts are facts. The leadership of Oom Yung Doe were convicted of a serious crime.

October 7, 2007 11:27 AM
 

Martial Artist said:

This statement by Mr DeLeon, a person who by his own statements is invested in the success of the Oom Yung Doe school, should be considered closely:

"like any organization that is made up of people, people can make a mistake. Because an individual makes a mistake, you cannot say that the entire organization is bad. You need look no further than our own university, and the recent abuse settlement. If the university is truly bad because of that one individual, than none of us should be students here."

We are talking about conviction of defrauding America of over 2 MILLION DOLLARS in tax revenue for personal gain. John C Kim, Robert Sawinsky, and Mike McKay are still in charge of this organization. Along with several others who were merely instructors at the time, each were found guilty in a lengthly and thorough legal process. They did not win on appeal. They were guilty.

Were pepretrators of the abuses at SU found guilty in such an extensive legal process? Were they then allowed to run the school subsequent to this? What would you think if the Dean and all department heads were guilty and still ran the university?

What if they changed the name from SU to XU to hide the connection? Oom Yung Doe was called "Chung Moo Doe" before the tax case. John C Kim's name has also changed since then. The underlying motivation for this shell-game should be considered, given the history of John C Kim has in misleading the public for profit.


October 7, 2007 12:07 PM
 

justinjmartin said:

Unfortunately, many people do choose to look at things in a negative way.  I can provide direct rebuttal, but I hate to do so because focusing on the negative is such a waste of time.  Negative and positive are like plants - the more you focus on them and feed them with your energy, the more they grow.  I will say a few things though.  

Anyone familiar with the American legal system knows that things are not always what they appear to be.  I'm pretty sure the convictions mentioned here were for conspiracy and not for actual fraud.  Conspiracy is what you are charged with when there is no proof you actually did anything wrong.  Also, the IRS spent over $6 million prosecuting this case.  Do you really think they would spend that much and not walk away with some kind of conviction?  

Regardless, the most important thing is that Grandmaster chose to take responsibility for the actions of the instructors in his schools, even though he could have allowed them to be convicted instead.  Does the Bible not say, "A house united shall stand, a house divided shall fall?"  That is one of the many traditions of Oom Yung Doe.  We stand up for even the weakest of our number, even when those who are weak hurt us.  We still care for them and we still want to help them improve and realize their full potential.  

The name did change from Chung Moo Doe to Oom Yung Doe, and there was at least one name change in the 70s or 80s too.  The name was changed as the training was upgraded, because the name directly reflects the content of the training.  Originally, Grandmaster wanted to release the more hard-style and intense training methods in order to build a strong instructor base.  The name at that time reflected that training style.  Then, as more and more movement and knowledge was released and as the training was changed to fit by people of all ages and conditions, the name changed.  I know this for a fact because I have trained under both the Chung Moo Doe method as well as under the Oom Yung Doe method.  "Oom Yung" is a Korean way of saying "Yin Yang."  This fits the training as it is passed now because it is truly balanced.  We use martial arts movements, herbs and herbal equipment, and meditation to harmonize our minds, bodies, and spirits.  Never has this type of training been so readily available in this country.  We are extremely fortunate to have it here.

The true facts are in the power of the training and the principles of Traditional Moo Doe (which is the root of Oom Yung Doe).  Talking will not cause people to experience miraculous physical recoveries.  Talking will not change a person from being depressed and fatigued to being alive and vibrant.  Only correct training methods can do so.  We have thousands of testimonials from people who have experienced this, and more are experiencing it every day.  Try it for yourself and see.  What makes me sad here is that people continue to attempt to deprive others from having this power available to them.  People who want to remain anonymous, too.  I am proud to associate my full name with the School of Oom Yung Doe.  I am proud to be a part of this organization and I am proud to be able to help other people attain the same inner peace in their own lives.  I am also grateful for this opportunity to discuss the training more.

Thank you,
Justin J. Martin
October 9, 2007 2:45 PM
 

Martial Artist said:

You're kidding right?
October 12, 2007 9:04 AM
 

Martial Artist said:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XyV-06JONjw

States have laws that prevent conspiracy charges to be pressed if no actions were taken to actually carry out the conspiracy. This prevents people from effectively being prosecuted for having thoughts of breaking the law. While this caveat does prevent some conspiracy cases from going to court, it does not reduce the severity of a conspiracy claim. In many cases, conspiracy to commit a crime such as murder is regarded as a crime as severe as murder itself.

Conspiracy crimes can include conspiracy to engage in criminal activity such as money laundering, conspiracy to violate federal laws, or conspiracy to manufacture drugs or weapons. The federal maximum penalty for conspiracy is five years in prison
October 12, 2007 9:21 AM
 

Martial Artist said:

Justin Said:
"Unfortunately, many people do choose to look at things in a negative way."

So, what you mean is those people who have been conned and scammed should just be all happy and positive?  Now that you mention it, it sure is a drag when victims of fraud and other crimes go around all mopey and sad, complaining and asking for "help".

Justin also said:
"Anyone familiar with the American legal system knows that things are not always what they appear to be...Conspiracy is what you are charged with when there is no proof you actually did anything wrong."

Justin seems to have disdain for the law. The bottom line thinking he offers is that the law should not be taken seriously. Everythings relative and we can disregard all that silly "legal" stuff. Sounds like you've learned well from your master, that much is clear. On the point of the law being disregarded, you are unfortunately dead wrong.

Perhaps a good law student can help you with that, you can read the facts here:
http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/9/9/1420632/95-CR-214-1%20Docket%20on%20JCKim%20and%20Chung%20Moo%20Doe.pdf

Conspiracy CONVICTIONS surely are not easy to prosecute and succeed with. Evidence is indeed necessary. Oom Yung Doe's leaders were found guilty based on clear evidence. The principle they broke was one of fairness, honesty, and giving to the country that protects and provides freedom based on a rule of law. That is why the were convicted and served time. That is why they are now ex-convicts who run the schools you teach in.

Now that we've adressed that fact, can we look at the validity of your supposed "International" recognition? This can be covered in a reasonable and fact based discussion as well. I submit your school is based on more than just tax fraud, but professional fraud as well.

Here's a starting point: If I say I am the Intergalactic Champion of the Universe, what do I need to do to prove it? Post the title on my website and in my handbook? How about if I make up a stamp and "certify" a letter saying I'm the Champion, is that proof?

Hopefully, the students at SU would look for more than that. Define independant verification of facts and we're headed in the right direction. Now look at the claims on the Oom Yung Doe website and start verifying.

As students, particularly at the graduate and professional level, scholarly rules of research prove invaluable.
October 12, 2007 10:00 AM
 

Martial Artist said:

From the official court docket when Kim and several National instructors were convicted, "the total amount of tax that the [members of the conspiracy] evaded or attempted to evade" during and in furtherance of the conspiracy of which defendants stand convicted, was $2,172,800.00.

That means the evidence showed that Kim hid over six million dollars in revenue (hence the 2 million in taxes)

http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/9/9/1420632/95-CR-214-1%20Docket%20on%20JCKim%20and%20Chung%20Moo%20Doe.pdf

Docket as of June 6, 2003 9:40 pm Page 97
Proceedings include all events. TERMED
1:95cr214-ALL USA v. Kim, et al ASHMAN
3/14/97 776 MINUTE ORDER of 3/14/97 by Hon. James F. Holderman as to
defendants John C Kim, Thomas Martin Hnat, Kenneth
Krisciunas, John Liska, Frank Kucia, Joselito Jakosalem,
Nicholas Gallo, Thomas NMI McGee, Sante Furio, Scott
Gigliotti, Thomas Condon, Michael D McKay : Applying the
definition of "tax loss" set forth in USSG section 2T1.1
made applicable by USSG section 2T1.9(a)(1), the court
finds by a preponderance of the evidence that "the total
amount of tax that the [members of the conspiracy] evaded
or attempted to evade" during and in furtherance of the
conspiracy of which defendants stand convicted, was
$2,172,800.00. (See reverse of minute order.) No notice (kk)
[Entry date 03/17/97]
October 14, 2007 7:30 PM
 

Josh said:

You can't be serious!
March 13, 2008 9:05 PM
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About Rob La Gatta

Rob La Gatta is a senior journalism student at Seattle University.

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